Congress this weekend


#101

Unfortunately those at the top have forgotten - or completely disregarded - the whole ethos and indeed raison d’etre for the organisation. Decisions are now made solely on commercial grounds - ironic for an amateur organisation. And everybody wants a slice of the pie - can you blame them?

Money should never be the bottom line in the GAA but as long as it is the very fabric and values of the organisation will continue to diminish and disappear.


#102

And a lot of that has been laid at our doorstep lately .


#103

And as we saw with the independent article about spending on teams, when it isn’t Dublin spending the most the story is very quickly allowed to die.


#104

Dublin operate strictly within the GAAs own rules.


#105

now that this is passed it’ll be forgotten about till June next year - but the way that it is going to work looks like this:

Each team will play
1 home match (croke park for us)
1 away match
1 match in croke park.

So we will have 1 away match.

in 2018, our group will be (assuming we win leinster):

Ulster champions,
Leinster champions,
Munster runner-up (or team that beats them in round four of the qualifiers)
Connacht runner-up (or team that beats them in round four of the qualifiers).

For the hell of it, lets call it -Dublin, Tyrone, Cork, Galway.

How is it decided which is our away game? Drawing lots? What happens if a leinster team is in there with us? If the Dublin/Tyrone game is in CP (lets face it, it will be for the money), then if the leinster team is there instead of Galway we have to go to Thurles to play Cork, or we have to go where(?) to play Galway.

The other thing is the knock on effect.

Super 8 will be played in August, but so will be all ireland finals. The only years coming up with 5 Sundays in August is 2020 and 2021, the others have 4.

So, assuming the last weekend of August is the football final sunday. The Hurling Final must be the week before. That means the Football semi finals must be the second weekend of August. It also means the Hurling Semi finals must be in the first weekend.

I cant see teams being happy with one week between the Super 8 and the semi finals, so the super 8 matches will have to actually be played in July…

So thats three weeks of July taken care of. Luckily enough there are 5 sundays in July 2018 (but only 4 in 2019 and 2020).

Half of the super 8’s must be from the qualifiers - which means that the beaten provincial finalists must play the last round. That should be the first week of July, as again teams may not want to go straight into the super 8 from a qualifier run.

But hold on!!

Whilst you cant have replays in any other games, you can have them in provincial finals - so you must make allowances for that. This pushes the provincial football finals way back to middle of June!

I’m not sure of any replays are allowed in the qualifiers (the GAA loves loopholes - the motion referred to "Championship"games but are the qualifiers outside of the championship?) but lets assume they’re not.

With no replays you would still need three or four rounds to run off provincial championship and with a week between each round rest thats still well over a month so you are pushing some provincial championships right back to the start of May.

The league ends 9th April this year to allow more weeks for clubs. The leinster championship this year starts on the 21st May. The super 8 will eliminate this gap by three to four weeks. So there will be a month between League and Championship which is where we were a few years ago when everyone started to look for more time for the clubs.

So the club argument is out the window, there is no room for club games from the start of may till the end of August. There may be one extra round available in April. There will be more in September -but if the GAA plan to bring the All Ireland Club Finals back to December are put into place you are simply moving the congestion of October to September, and this whole exercise is paying lip service to the clubs yet again and in effect will result in full time intercounty players from February till August for at least 8 counties.


#106

[quote=“dubintipp, post:105, topic:1714, full:true”]
now that this is passed it’ll be forgotten about till June next year - but the way that it is going to work looks like this:

Each team will play
1 home match (croke park for us)
1 away match
1 match in croke park.

So we will have 1 away match.

in 2018, our group will be (assuming we win leinster):

Ulster champions,
Leinster champions,
Munster runner-up (or team that beats them in round four of the qualifiers)
Connacht runner-up (or team that beats them in round four of the qualifiers).

For the hell of it, lets call it -Dublin, Tyrone, Cork, Galway.

How is it decided which is our away game? Drawing lots? What happens if a leinster team is in there with us? If the Dublin/Tyrone game is in CP (lets face it, it will be for the money), then if the leinster team is there instead of Galway we have to go to Thurles to play Cork, or we have to go where(?) to play Galway.

The other thing is the knock on effect.

Super 8 will be played in August, but so will be all ireland finals. The only years coming up with 5 Sundays in August is 2020 and 2021, the others have 4.

So, assuming the last weekend of August is the football final sunday. The Hurling Final must be the week before. That means the Football semi finals must be the second weekend of August. It also means the Hurling Semi finals must be in the first weekend.

I cant see teams being happy with one week between the Super 8 and the semi finals, so the super 8 matches will have to actually be played in July…

So thats three weeks of July taken care of. Luckily enough there are 5 sundays in July 2018 (but only 4 in 2019 and 2020).

Half of the super 8’s must be from the qualifiers - which means that the beaten provincial finalists must play the last round. That should be the first week of July, as again teams may not want to go straight into the super 8 from a qualifier run.

But hold on!!

Whilst you cant have replays in any other games, you can have them in provincial finals - so you must make allowances for that. This pushes the provincial football finals way back to middle of June!

I’m not sure of any replays are allowed in the qualifiers (the GAA loves loopholes - the motion referred to "Championship"games but are the qualifiers outside of the championship?) but lets assume they’re not.

With no replays you would still need three or four rounds to run off provincial championship and with a week between each round rest thats still well over a month so you are pushing some provincial championships right back to the start of May.

The league ends 9th April this year to allow more weeks for clubs. The leinster championship this year starts on the 21st May. The super 8 will eliminate this gap by three to four weeks. So there will be a month between League and Championship which is where we were a few years ago when everyone started to look for more time for the clubs.

So the club argument is out the window, there is no room for club games from the start of may till the end of August. There may be one extra round available in April. There will be more in September -but if the GAA plan to bring the All Ireland Club Finals back to December are put into place you are simply moving the congestion of October to September, and this whole exercise is paying lip service to the clubs yet again and in effect will result in full time intercounty players from February till August for at least 8 counties.
[/quote]. Counties won’t bother with the club championship until September.

The rest will be a total mess, as you rightly point out.


#107

As if the GAA season wasnt complicated enough, you now need a diagram to follow the bloody thing.


#108

Not very well informed on this, but two doubts, one is on the replay thing, what if a match is level after extra time? Will they have a peno shoot out or what. Secondly I don’t really get the uproar about the club champo, in so far as to me it seems to free up club players from september on, at the moment they are not free to play club until after the 3rd week of September. Not saying that the present situation is good, but as regards time the new one seems a bit of an improvement.
Maybe it would be an idea not to start the club champo until September, then at least club players would know where they stand and could plan their summer, rather than just hanging about waiting for the county teams to get knocked out.
I don`t see any reason why the club champo could not be run off in two months, September and October and the weather should still be reasonably ok. As I said I am not very well informed on the issue, so if I have got something totally wrong, please don’t lynch me:laughing:


#109

You’ve gone and done it now BigP! :sweat_smile:


#110

Was there not talk of a peno shootout or something along those lines being brought in or is that only in the hurling ?


#111

My understanding was the Hurling wasn’t even discussed…


#112

Yet you still wrote a multi paragraph war and peace on the subject!!! :slight_smile:

There are some CPA meetings in the next week to inform the masses on their position so we should get a greater idea on the argument then.


#113

Maybe it would be a good idea? Along with the money this is exactly what they want. No club championship until September will be the norm in most of the top ten or twelve counties from now on.


#114

The issue is that a lot of counties played club championship during the summer in the breaks between county matches (unlike dublin).


#115

The depth of anger it seems from people anti the super 8 is a bit off the wall. We are planning to give Rugby all our best GAA grounds to stage a world cup (well a world where only 8 countries play the sport at any serious level) and further enhance their threat to the GAA - that is a problem, not a slight change in the championship structure.

Some of the Twitter comments etc. from well known players are totally out of proportion to the issue at hand. Also, there are many disparate groups against the super 8, yet they are treating it as a concerted effort against the majority. But some are anti because of club fixtures, some are anti because their county isn’t good enough to reach the semis (except for a lucky draw), some are against it because the weaker counties won’t get more games (so are contrary to the people who want more time for clubs). So basically if any of these groups got their wish, they would face a backlash from people they are sharing a platform with now.

I heard a rant by Tommy Carr on the radio recently against the mark ( a very good rule change in my opinion), he contradicted himself many times in the thing, and again it was just out of proportion to the issue. Someone listening who didn’t know the game would think they were planning on outlawing handling the ball or something. The GAA is a democracy, if you don’t get something you want, get over it - or fight to get it through congress.


#116

yeah but there are so many reasons against it being offered and the official reason for it is seemingly not easily defensible.

It’s in now anyway, and it will not be until its actually road tested next year that we will know the real ins and outs, although I stick by the mooted calandar I posted yesterday and what I think are the moving forces behind it.

From the Dublin point of view it adds one away match but it also adds an interesting match up with another provincial winner right away as opposed to the semi finals now.

I imagine that the semi finals will be winner group A/runner up group B so you could have some interesting attempts to get an easy semi final in the last game if you have won the first two.


#117

[quote=“alanoc, post:106, topic:1714, full:true”]

If clubs finish all other competitions up to September it could work nicely


#118

Suppose Louth (or even Meath and many others) got to a QF - how could they possibly accommodate all the support Dublin would bring?


#119

An issue I see as well is a team losing 2 matches and having nothing to play for in their final game. How do they approach it, especially if it’s away.

Say in this case Dublin beat Cork and Tyrone beat Galway. In the second round of matches Dublin and Tyrone draw and Galway beat Cork.

In the final games Cork have nothing to play for, are away to Tyrone and field a weakened team. Tyrone duly hammer them and we beat Galway but by a much inferior scoreline. Therefore Tyrone top the group and play the runner up from the other group.

I’m using Dublin in this example but it could easily be the other way round with Tyrone.


#120

A huge problem. Potentially you could have a team lose two of three games and go through bob score difference. Makes a joke of winning an All Ireland.