Boris doesn’t even bother to show up in the Commons for the Brexit debate…

Probably off playing cricket or killing some poor immigrant in adults v kids rugby


I think Cameron was a good PM and I think he’ll be missed.

He included the referendum because he believed in the UK’s necessity to be part of the EU.

the next guy won’t. So I don’t see what Cameron risked. He gave the Euro sceptics a democratic choice and they’ve now played Russian roulette with their economic future.

A lot of the propaganda on the leave side has been proven to be lies. There are no lies to being part of the EU - the benefits are there to be seen. I do laugh when I read Irish people talk about our Crash and how it was the EU’s fault.

it wasn’t. It was ours- no regulation , corrupt bankers and an even more corrupt political system


He included the referendum either because he was under pressure from his party members to do or he felt that it would win him votes, he had no need to include it, Why would he have? No other country has done so. But IMO and this is in hindsight, I think he was overconfident of a Remain win and had no plan in place for a Leave win and this why there is now panic among the Remain campaigners and also probably the reason he has resigned… IMO he held the two referendums, both the Scottish and this for political gain , but he surely should have known what he was risking, he won one and lost the other, but could eventually end up losing both.


Was it not an effort to stave off UKIP and to appease the tory far right.


Yes. And UKIP, in the British system, was no threat at all.

Cameron made an awful mess of this. There was no need for Cameron to promise a referendum at all. It’s some mess now. And the blonde idiot is not the answer.


I think a better EU would have been able to impose more regulation on things like banking, infrastructure decisions etc, just as they de facto imposed the cuts politics/economics of the last 8 years via IMF demands etc. It’s all very well to cry “they can’t interfere in nation states” when in fact they allowed the banks get away with what people say are the fault of the banks. Twice!

Furthermore we all know the banks of Europe (and beyond) are very interlinked


The EU get involved to that extent and you’ll have lads like farage saying they’re meddling.


No need for another referendum, England confirmed tonight they want out of Europe:laughing:


Bar the first line, I’d agree with that, Bart. What I will point out, thiugh, is that the Leave campaign’s promises are being exposed because they won. If the remain campaign had won, some of their claims would have been exposed.


This crisis either shows democracy is flawed or a nation with a high proportion of imbeciles got exactly what they deserved.

In my view, choices such as these shouldn’t be put to the people in referendums. Circa 52% of the voting population should not have the right to commit economic suicide on behalf of those who didn’t or couldn’t.


Almost certainly the latter.


Totally agree @daedalus

not just economic suicide, their rights to travel and work right across Europe.


There was a ‘leave’ businessman on the news last night more or less accusing the remain side for what was happening - ie for carrying through on their ‘scare’ campaign.

And he is a businessman …




Was it Mike Ashley???


I know this probably wasnt practical but shouldn’t the exit deal be negotiated first and then put to a referendum so that people know exactly what they are voting for?

Did Ireland in the 70s vote on an actual treaty or just a vague notion to join the EEC?


We sure did, but the result was the desired one. I don`t agree that people should not be given the right to vote on these issues, but I do feel the politicians should stay completely out of it. The problem is that politicians try to influence people and send out confusing messages, also people tend to follow their parties rather than thinking about what is best. Once a referendum has been called it means the politicians have put the decision in the hands of the people and it should be left at that, when I say politicians I would include any kind of organized campaign either in favor or against. I am sure if this happened far less people would vote, but you would get a far more educated vote.


‘The people have no right to do wrong.’

A two thirds majority on decisions of such importance might be the way to go in future.


A two third majority would make it very difficult to change anything, maybe if you have to choose yes or no for something new, but when choosing to continue with something or change it, it would be almost impossible to get 2/3 majority, also you could argue to have it the other way round . Why not 1/3 needed to leave and 2/3 to remain.
As regards the people having no right to do wrong, nobody has done wrong, both sides would argue that the other is wrong.


The GAA have a two third majority and we can all see what a joke that is !
The English people have spoken but it became a referendum about race and not economics
The by product of this will be economic suicide which will have far more reaching impact then any racial benefits they think so highly of !